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  1. #26
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    If it was made from chakra it's getting absorbed. If something is being manipulated by chakra like Gaara's sand only the chakra gets absorbed.
     
         

  2. #27
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Quote Originally Posted by Strict View Post
    But still it is a Ninjutsu, he uses his Chakra in oder to fetch the big masses of sand and control them. By absorbing the Chakra out if it instantly, he would render it useless; he would render anything useless by touching it, even people by using Taijutsu. You just contradict yourself.
    What? Nothing I said contradicts with anything. Gaara can control sand... that is his ability. He was able to control the sand before he even infused chakra into it. He only infused chakra into it to make the sand stronger.
    The sand itself has no chakra inside it. It isn't a living thing. It wasn't made from chakra. Preta path can't absorb it.
     
         
    Last edited by iSpeak; 06-22-2012 at 05:32 PM.

  3. #28
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Quote Originally Posted by iSpeak View Post
    What? Nothing I said contradicts with anything. Gaara can control sand... that is his ability. He was able to control the sand before he even infused chakra into it. He only infused chakra into it to make it stronger.
    The sand itself has no chakra inside it. It isn't a living thing. It wasn't made from chakra. Preta path can't absorb it.
    I am right, though. Even if the Mokuton is controlled by Chakra too, it would take a time to absorb it but not in an instant by touching it while it is going to crush him. Therefore Madara stated purposely, that the weakness of Preta-Path are physical attacks. If he would drain out the Chakra of this amount of trees, the Preta Path would kill people when they are going to touch him, by absorbing the Chakra instantly.

    The battle situations you imagine are total illogical, in an actual fight he would never leave the wood useless with a touch, also he wouldn't absorb the Susanoo while the user is doing nothing.

    I agree that Nagato is able to absorb Susanoo or Chakra from objects, but let's stay logical.
     
         

  4. #29
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Quote Originally Posted by Strict View Post
    He absorbed the Rasenshuriken by using the Preta Path with his outstratched hand, what it has to do with the sand on his other; can you actually say that he used the Preta Path with his whole body? In fact he was buried by Gaaras sand several times, why didn't he absorbed it?

    Many flaws in your claims. Preta Path can absorb Chakra in any form, but not each Ninjutsu is formed Chakra. Is the Ninjutsu 'Sanju Rashomon' a form of Chakra? Is Orochimarus Ninjutsu-Technique which let his neck grow a form of Chakra? No. Susanoo is a form of Chakra 'cause the Chakra forms into it. The Rasenshuriken is a form of Chakra by concentrating Chakra in his hand and giving some wind affinity to that. Jiraiyas oil is a form of Chakra, too. But the wood of the Mokuton is not a form of Chakra, Kimimaros Bones are no form of Ninjutsu, some other Ninjutsus, too.

    I mean even Madara states that physical techniques are working on him. Would Madara state this, if he could absorb the Cakra of objects in an instant? In this case Taijutsu is not working on the Preta Path, too, since one touch absorbs all the Chakra.

    Just think about it.

    Now you are just being a smartarse with those list of examples. By any form of ninjutsu we obviously mean the nature affinitys. The page I showed you shows Madara absorbing Naruto's RS as well as Gaara's sand, hence why it was rendered useless and started falling. It does not matter why he didnt absorb it before because that is not the point, the point is that Preta Path actually absorbed something solid as Gaara's sand through its chakra.

    Mokuton is not a form of chakra? Mate you obviously havent done your homework about Hashirama's KG since its a combo of water and earth natures. The main problem that people seem to believe that Preta Path actually physically absorbs, when in fact its merely absorbing the chakra that flows through it, ie. Gaara's sand.
     
         
    Last edited by Out Of Ctrl; 06-22-2012 at 05:48 PM.

  5. #30
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Quote Originally Posted by Strict View Post
    I am right, though. Even if the Mokuton is controlled by Chakra too, it would take a time to absorb it but not in an instant by touching it while it is going to crush him. Therefore Madara stated purposely, that the weakness of Preta-Path are physical attacks. If he would drain out the Chakra of this amount of trees, the Preta Path would kill people when they are going to touch him, by absorbing the Chakra instantly.

    The battle situations you imagine are total illogical, in an actual fight he would never leave the wood useless with a touch, also he wouldn't absorb the Susanoo while the user is doing nothing.

    I agree that Nagato is able to absorb Susanoo or Chakra from objects, but let's stay logical.
    What the hell are you talking about? Mokuton is chakra! It was made from chakra! Gaara's sand is real sand! Which is why it is listed under "tools".
    What does the amount of time it takes to absorb it have to do with anything? This tread is able whether he can absorb it or not. So stop trying to change the subject. He can absorb all forms of chakra. Gaara's sand is a TOOL. It isn't made from chakra. Fact.
    No matter how long it may take it, the Preta path is able to absorb any form of chakra.
     
         
    Last edited by iSpeak; 06-22-2012 at 05:46 PM.

  6. #31
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Quote Originally Posted by iSpeak View Post
    What the hell are you talking about? Mokuton is chakra! It was made from chakra! Gaara's sand is real sand! Which is why it is listed under "tools".
    What does the amount of time it takes to absorb it have to do with anything? This tread is able whether he can absorb it or not. So stop trying to change the subject. He can absorb all forms of chakra. Gaara's sand is a TOOL. It isn't made from chakra. Fact.
    No matter how long it may take it, the Preta path is able to absorb any form of chakra.
    I already said that Nagato can absorb the Chakra out from the Mokuton too, but in an actual fight it is not feasible and this is what counts .
     
         

  7. #32
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    No Preta path cld absorb jirya's oil . . . . so the chakra spawned matter CAN be absorbed.
    I think preta absorbtion does not work on clones as they are imitations of life and have life force, and pretapath can only absorb chakra. Similarly Mokuton should have this immunity too as the trees are actually living things.
     
         

  8. #33
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Quote Originally Posted by Strict View Post
    I already said that Nagato can absorb the Chakra out from the Mokuton too, but in an actual fight it is not feasible and this is what counts .
    The whole Mokuton is chakra. The chakra has just been materialised into a solid. The Preta path would be able to absorb all of it. It would just be like absorbing Susanoo.
    How long it would take and whether he would have enough time to do it is another question though.
     
         
    Last edited by iSpeak; 06-22-2012 at 05:58 PM.

  9. #34
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Also people questioning about the time it would take to absorb anything by Nagato's Preta Path then observe this page again.

    Notice how fast Nagato absorbs Bee's chakra cloak form making him go back to his normal state in almost an instant.

     
         

  10. #35
    Senior Member Anorien16's Avatar
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Quote Originally Posted by iSpeak View Post
    The whole Mokuton is chakra. The chakra has just been materialised into a solid. The Preta path would be able to absorb all of it.
    How long it would take and whether he would have enough time to do it is another question though.
    Mokuton are usually actually living trees whose growth is accelerated infinately after formation. See: http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/120/6 and u will see that the trees are actually growing. Another fact is that things made of chakra need a supply of chakra to maintain itself, and Konoha's trees made by mokuton is yet to disappear or die.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheEye View Post
    Also people questioning about the time it would take to absorb anything by Nagato's Preta Path then observe this page again.

    Notice how fast Nagato absorbs Bee's chakra cloak form making him go back to his normal state in almost an instant.



    Yes but while nagato is busy sucking chakra from the trees, a wood clone rigged with exploasive tags can hit him with a sword and self detonate.
     
         
    Last edited by Anorien16; 06-22-2012 at 06:10 PM.

  11. #36
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Quote Originally Posted by iSpeak View Post
    The whole Mokuton is chakra. The chakra has just been materialised into a solid. The Preta path would be able to absorb all of it. It would just be like absorbing Susanoo.
    How long it would take and whether he would have enough time to do it is another question though.
    You're wrong in every possible way.

    The trees of Mokuton aren't made up of Chakra, but in fact real, living trees. Despite Mokuton being an element, it is not Chakra converted into trees. It is Chakra converted into a source of life that grows real trees, or rather increases their rate of growth. That is what you, and seemingly the majority of NarutoBase don't get. So, to put it in a nutshell, the trees created by Mokuton are not Chakra. It's questionable if there's actually any Chakra inside those trees, since Hashirama is controlling them from the earth.
     
         

  12. #37
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Quote Originally Posted by TheEye View Post
    Also people questioning about the time it would take to absorb anything by Nagato's Preta Path then observe this page again.

    Notice how fast Nagato absorbs Bee's chakra cloak form making him go back to his normal state in almost an instant.

    But yet we was hit by Killerbee before started to absorb, right? Also you cannot compare a human sized chakra cloak with a forest where a single tendril has a diameter size of at least one Susanoo.

    Physical techniques are working on Nagato, obviously. And the Mokuton consists out of real trees, Hashirama creates them by fitting just the ground and accelerate their growth by fitting their source of life; their root. The impact that the Mokuton causes will crush Nagato in an instant, he won't even be able to absorb anything in time.
     
         

  13. #38
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Quote Originally Posted by Anorien16 View Post
    Mokuton are usually actually living trees whose growth is accelerated infinately after formation. See: http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/120/6 and u will see that the trees are actually growing. Another fact is that thinks made of chakra need a supply of chakra to maintain itself, and Konoha's trees made by mokuton is yet to disappear or die.
    Only Hashirama's trees become alive because he is able to add Yang (which is the half his clan inherited from the Sage) into it for vitality.
    Yamato/Zetsu/Danzo are not able to do that. They are just dead wood.
     
         

  14. #39
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Quote Originally Posted by FloriGlori View Post
    You're wrong in every possible way.

    The trees of Mokuton aren't made up of Chakra, but in fact real, living trees. Despite Mokuton being an element, it is not Chakra converted into trees. It is Chakra converted into a source of life that grows real trees, or rather increases their rate of growth. That is what you, and seemingly the majority of NarutoBase don't get. So, to put it in a nutshell, the trees created by Mokuton are not Chakra. It's questionable if there's actually any Chakra inside those trees, since Hashirama is controlling them from the earth.
    And this is rather confirmed in the databook, right?
     
         

  15. #40
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Quote Originally Posted by FloriGlori View Post
    You're wrong in every possible way.

    The trees of Mokuton aren't made up of Chakra, but in fact real, living trees. Despite Mokuton being an element, it is not Chakra converted into trees. It is Chakra converted into a source of life that grows real trees, or rather increases their rate of growth. That is what you, and seemingly the majority of NarutoBase don't get. So, to put it in a nutshell, the trees created by Mokuton are not Chakra. It's questionable if there's actually any Chakra inside those trees, since Hashirama is controlling them from the earth.
    No, this is what you don't understand. Only Hashirama's trees are living because he is able to add Yang Release to it, which gives it Vitality. Danzo/Yamato/Zetsu don't have this. This is why Yamato's trees and the Zetsu clones reacted to Naruto's Yang cloak.
    Yang Release is still a form of chakra, which can be absorbed. The only difference now is that they have life given properties. It is made by altering the balance between Spiritual energy and Physical energy. Healing another person uses Yang release, yet it doesn't affect their chakra. Hashirama's trees are still chakra. The 9 tailed beasts are still chakra.
     
         
    Last edited by iSpeak; 06-22-2012 at 06:22 PM.

  16. #41
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Nagato uprooting TREE'S from an entire area of a forest, i wonder how Hashi is gonna hit him with it?.

     
         

  17. #42
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Quote Originally Posted by Strict View Post
    And this is rather confirmed in the databook, right?
    Unnecessary question, Strict. Of course it is.
     
         

  18. #43
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Quote Originally Posted by FloriGlori View Post
    Unnecessary question, Strict. Of course it is.
    You see iSpeak, you should end this countless posts about the same thing over and over again, Flori and I explained very well how the Mokuton is actually working, rather Flori explained it by using the original version of the databook he has at home.

    You Nagato-Fans will always cling to the last straw; since the Mokuton is not just materialized Chakra, what was rather stated by the third databook, you should come with better facts .

    But I guess your next argument will consist out of 'Preta absorbs anything' and 'Mokuton is made up of Chakra' as always. Just don't waste your time.
     
         

  19. #44
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Quote Originally Posted by iSpeak View Post
    Only Hashirama's trees become alive because he is able to add Yang (which is the half his clan inherited from the Sage) into it for vitality.
    Yamato/Zetsu/Danzo are not able to do that. They are just dead wood.
    Funnily enough, every one has potential for yin and yang . . . . in fact every genjutsu is yin release ...... Its just that Hashi's yang release is stronger and thus his Mokuton stronger. Plus u forget Yamato, Zetsu and Danzo have part of Hashiirama in him which allows them mokuton in the first place. Also as the mokuton appears and grows, the chakra (yang) has already been converted to life force, so naraka path will have to attack the user physically at the body where the conversion is taking place.

    Quote Originally Posted by raju22 View Post
    Nagato uprooting TREE'S from an entire area of a forest, i wonder how Hashi is gonna hit him with it?.

    Those are regular trees not chakra infused gaint trees. Also ST cant do much harm underground.

    Also note this is not a VS thread.
     
         
    Last edited by Anorien16; 06-22-2012 at 06:29 PM.

  20. #45
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Quote Originally Posted by Strict View Post
    But yet we was hit by Killerbee before started to absorb, right? Also you cannot compare a human sized chakra cloak with a forest where a single tendril has a diameter size of at least one Susanoo.

    Physical techniques are working on Nagato, obviously. And the Mokuton consists out of real trees, Hashirama creates them by fitting just the ground and accelerate their growth by fitting their source of life; their root. The impact that the Mokuton causes will crush Nagato in an instant, he won't even be able to absorb anything in time.
    It does not matter whether its human sized, where do you think that chakra cloak came from? Last time I remember Tailed Beasts were creatures with enormous chakra. And that was just an example I used to show the speed of Nagato's absorption.

    Why do you keep bringing up physical attacks? There are numerous ways Nagato can handle physical attacks. And how do you think Hashirama has control over the trees? By his chakra of course, since it feeds the life force of the trees in order for it to grow instantly. But if that chakra is taken away then it will cease to grow rapdily or have control.

    Why do you keep changing the subject? We are not here to discuss whether Mokuton will crush Nagato or not because he has plenty of ways to prevent that. Also it does not matter because when required Preta Path has the ability to make a barrier as a defense whilst absorbing at the same time.




     
         

  21. #46
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Quote Originally Posted by TheEye View Post
    It does not matter whether its human sized, where do you think that chakra cloak came from? Last time I remember Tailed Beasts were creatures with enormous chakra. And that was just an example I used to show the speed of Nagato's absorption.

    Why do you keep bringing up physical attacks? There are numerous ways Nagato can handle physical attacks. And how do you think Hashirama has control over the trees? By his chakra of course, since it feeds the life force of the trees in order for it to grow instantly. But if that chakra is taken away then it will cease to grow rapdily or have control.

    Why do you keep changing the subject? We are not here to discuss whether Mokuton will crush Nagato or not because he has plenty of ways to prevent that. Also it does not matter because when required Preta Path has the ability to make a barrier as a defense whilst absorbing at the same time.






    The barrier bans away chakra in its original shape, only. Should reread how Preta Path is actually working.
     
         

  22. #47
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Quote Originally Posted by TheEye View Post
    And how do you think Hashirama has control over the trees? By his chakra of course, since it feeds the life force of the trees in order for it to grow instantly. But if that chakra is taken away then it will cease to grow rapdily or have control.
    So you're implying that Nagato could stop one of those tendrils from growing at a time? Seems very helpfull, especially since there are hundreds of them growing in an instant.

     
         

  23. #48
    Senior Member Anorien16's Avatar
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Quote Originally Posted by TheEye View Post
    It does not matter whether its human sized, where do you think that chakra cloak came from? Last time I remember Tailed Beasts were creatures with enormous chakra. And that was just an example I used to show the speed of Nagato's absorption.

    Why do you keep bringing up physical attacks? There are numerous ways Nagato can handle physical attacks. And how do you think Hashirama has control over the trees? By his chakra of course, since it feeds the life force of the trees in order for it to grow instantly. But if that chakra is taken away then it will cease to grow rapdily or have control.

    Why do you keep changing the subject? We are not here to discuss whether Mokuton will crush Nagato or not because he has plenty of ways to prevent that. Also it does not matter because when required Preta Path has the ability to make a barrier as a defense whilst absorbing at the same time.




    Preata's barrier is absorption barrier not a defence one.

    Also take chakra away from Hashirama, preta will have attack Hashirama physically as the conversion of chakra to life force takes place within or near his body.
     
         

  24. #49
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Quote Originally Posted by FloriGlori View Post
    So you're implying that Nagato could stop one of those tendrils from growing at a time? Seems very helpfull, especially since there are hundreds of them growing in an instant.

    He doesnt need to stop every tendrils, only ones that would actually affect him. But of course if he wanted to stop all of them there's always Shinra Tensei for that.

    Anyway I'm not here to discuss that but rather whether Preta Path can absorb solid ninjutsu such as Mokuton and it rightfully can.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anorien16 View Post
    Preata's barrier is absorption barrier not a defence one.

    Also take chakra away from Hashirama, preta will have attack Hashirama physically as the conversion of chakra to life force takes place within or near his body.
    It does not change the fact that its also acting as a defense from an upcoming ninjutsu attack. :shrug: This is not a vs thread where we should be discussing the requirements for Preta Path to physically touch Hashirama.
     
         
    Last edited by Out Of Ctrl; 06-22-2012 at 06:40 PM.

  25. #50
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    Re: preta cant absorb kagebunshins? you have to tell my why

    Quote Originally Posted by Anorien16 View Post
    Funnily enough, every one has potential for yin and yang . . . . in fact every genjutsu is yin release ...... Its just that Hashi's yang release is stronger and thus his Mokuton stronger. Plus u forget Yamato, Zetsu and Danzo have part of Hashiirama in him which allows them mokuton in the first place. Also as the mokuton appears and grows, the chakra (yang) has already been converted to life force, so naraka path will have to attack the user physically at the body where the conversion is taking place..
    Everybody has Yin and Yang but not everybody is able to use Yin Release and Yang Release.
    I didn't forget they had Hashirama's cells in him... that was my whole point. They are all able to use Mokuton but they are not able to use Yang Release with it (which is why Zetsu and Yamato's wood reacted to Naruto's Yang cloak). The Yang Release only gives the chakra life properties... it is still chakra. Which can be absorbed.
     
         

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